20
Jan
2008
Posted by The Mad Ape as Blogging 101, Scams, Traffic Building
My blog entry yesterday was about how Scribd banned outgoing links from their site. After reading their response to my questions, one can see that the SEO tactics, as described by Don Crowther, in his video ‘No Secrets, were in violation of their TOS.
It looks as though Scribd is blaming StomperNet for the banning, in particluar Don Crowther. WOW…I wonder if he will end up being the scapegoat on this. Apparently his so-called white hat tactics were pretty dirty. A head may roll on this one.
An important thing to remember is that you must read the TOS of web sites you join. We all get so used to just checking off and agreeing to terms, that we get caught in messes like this. I think Don did not read the legaleeze.
At the end of the Scribd response, they claim that they will be offering a service for ‘legitimate’ marketers…probably will be a paid service…something that I eluded to yesterday on another blog.

Jason Bentley to me, contact
show details 4:11 AM (5 hours ago)
Thanks for contacting us.
First off, it’s important to understand that we have never allowed the use of SEO tactics on the Scribd website. Such tactics, along with hidden linking, deep linking, and malicious JavaScript have always been a violation of our Terms of Service. Despite this, we’ve been highly tolerant of marketing documents that make use of one or two links to another site. This is because we felt it was important to provide our users with an option to display their document in HTML instead of FlashPaper. For a long time, marketers on Scribd represented a small - and largely responsible - percentage of our community.
The number of documents that crossed the line from “marketing” to spam dramatically increased toward the end of 2007. We’d already started to reevaluate our HTML policy when suddenly, over the holidays, Scribd was flooded with thousands of garden-variety spam documents and still many more innocent-looking “informational” documents that were a cornucopia of malicious marketing: hidden links, browser-jacking JavaScript - the works.
After considering our options, we made the difficult decision to enact both a zero-tolerance policy toward HTML marketing and a temporary no-link policy across the board. We disabled HTML uploads, and because of the deluge of new spam-oriented accounts, we were forced to ban most of the HTML marketers already on Scribd.
As expected, we received a storm of complaints, and of course, many mentioned the StomperNet video. After I watched the clip, one fact stood out to me: whether through ignorance, carelessness, or malice, the guy instructed everyone watching to actively violate Scribd’s Terms of Service without any kind of disclaimer to that fact. This was reflected in the common threads were consistent throughout the many complaints and apologies we received: “I didn’t know I was doing anything wrong” and “I never read the Terms of Service.”
So one thing I would stress to your readers is: never base elements of your business on services for which you have not read the contract or Terms of Service. It’s as simple as that. Business ain’t for lemmings. Don’t follow the advice of a disembodied voice in an online video without doing your due diligence.
With all that said, legitimate and responsible marketers will soon be able to again use Scribd to drive traffic. We’ve been working on a solution that will let legitimate marketers place working links within documents, but without the mechanisms that left our site and our users vulnerable to predatory practices. Look for it in about two weeks, give or take, once we get everything in place.
Best regards,
Jason
–
Jason Bentley
Director, Community Development @ Scribd
jason@scribd.com
http://scribd.com
Finally, I have asked StomperNet for a response to this statement from Scribd. It will be interesting to see their response:
Hello
I am the Mad Ape and am investigating the banning of outgoing links on Scribd and would like to get a response from Don Crowther of StomperNet. In particular I would like him to respond to the following statement from Scribd:
“As expected, we received a storm of complaints, and of course, many mentioned the StomperNet video. After I watched the clip, one fact stood out to me: whether through ignorance, carelessness, or malice, the guy instructed everyone watching to actively violate Scribd’s Terms of Service without any kind of disclaimer to that fact.”
- Jason Bentley
Director, Community Development @ ScribdMr Crowther could you please answer the following:
1) Did you read Scribd’s Terms of Service?
2) Do you think that Scribd is unfairly singling you and your company out?
3) How do you intend to deal with this matter?
4) What will happen to the SMARTS program?
So as not to be claimed that I took this out of context, please see the entire Scribd statement on my blog at http://www.tatumba.com/blog/archives/324
Thank you for your time,
Sincerely;
The Mad Ape
www.tatumba.com
So until next time…
Technorati Tags: scribd, stompernet, seo tactics, scribd blames stompernet, jason bentley, don crowther
22 Responses
Jason Bentley
January 20th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
1I understand that you’re trying to create a story here, but I singled the StomperNet video out because you specifically asked about it, Ape. And you’re 100% wrong about a paid service. You’re really flying blind without knowing what you’re talking about or what you’re doing, and this rather ham-handed attempt to start a ‘war of statements’ is pretty crass.
For future reference, it’s “Scribd,” not Sribd.
Jason Bentley
January 20th, 2008 at 3:28 pm
2“I am the Mad Ape and am seeking clarification to the rumors
surrounding your recent cessation of outgoing links from scribd.com
by your users.
Can you confirm this to be the case? Further, can
you confirm whether or not this was a direct reaction to the
abnormally high increase in outgoing link (traffic) activity resulting
from people using the advice contained in a video by StomperNet called
“No Secrets”?”
And *I’m* the one singling StomperNet out?
The Mad Ape
January 21st, 2008 at 7:11 am
3Sorry for the typo Jason. And if you read the email I sent again, which was posted on here prior to your reply, you will see that there were rumors ‘out there’ - do the research dude. I did not start this.
I asked you to confirm, you did. I am not making the story. You guys are. You admitted that the bulks of complaints mentioned the video. I reported it as you told it.
I have been 100% transparent with this. Some humans have a hard time with transparency.
Also I was only speculating with respect to a paid service. I guess I was wrong. I will live. Can’t wait to see how you determine what a ‘marketer versus spammer’ is.
The Mad Ape
Jason Bentley
January 21st, 2008 at 12:46 pm
4An anonymous blogger with a furry alter-ego is not transparent.
You ask leading questions based on half-baked conclusions that you glean from ’statements’ (actually private emails). If you were actually
transparent, you would print the full correspondence, starting from your initial solicitation of comment, in toto, back-to-back.
My email to you made clear that the spam/HTML problems preceded the StomperNet
video and that we were already in the process of changing our policy when the video was released. The email sent to you addressed only the specific questions you asked about. We were very aware of rumors out there, and we’ve even addressed some of those rumors in other forums.
I’m not as concerned about the “marketer” vs “spammer” distinction. It’s much like distinguishing a “reporter” from a “blogger.” It’s a matter of maturity, reputation, and intent.
I *am* concerned about your tactics. Some examples:
Scribd said: “As expected, we received a storm of complaints, and of course, many mentioned the StomperNet video. After I watched the clip, one fact stood out to me: whether through ignorance, carelessness, or malice, the guy instructed everyone watching to actively violate Scribd’s Terms of Service without any kind of disclaimer to that fact.”
Transparent Ape says: “It looks as though Sribd [sic] is blaming StomperNet for the banning, in particluar Don Crowther. WOW” and later “you admitted that the bulks of complaints mentioned the video. I reported it as you told it.”
Well, not quite there, bud. There’s a serious and disturbing disconnect between what I’ve emailed you and the quote-less paraphrasing that you “report.”
I’m gonna be honest: You come off like the kid in school that can only divert attention his way through exaggeration, half-truth, and manipulative behavior. You know, the tattle-taler that runs back and forth between this teacher and that teacher with slightly differing stories and loads of plausible deniability. So in that sense, yes, you’re 100% transparent.
My advice to your readers remains the same: don’t trust the online ‘experts’ - whoever they are - without doing your due diligence. You really can’t trust these people.
Dan Thies
January 21st, 2008 at 12:58 pm
5Ape, read these words again:
“The number of documents that crossed the line from “marketing” to spam dramatically increased toward the end of 2007. We’d already started to reevaluate our HTML policy when suddenly, over the holidays, Scribd was flooded”
Scribd has been getting a lot of buzz in SEO circles since last fall, and a flood “over the holidays” can’t be attibuted to Don Crowther’s video. More likely, it was due to the number of people at Pubcon who were talking about how to spam Scribed.
You might want to watch Don Crowther’s video yourself, since spamming is exactly what he told people not to do.
Dan Thies’s last blog post..Up For A SEMMY or Five - Guess I Should Write More…
The Mad Ape
January 21st, 2008 at 2:31 pm
6> Jason Bentley said: An anonymous blogger with a furry alter-ego is not transparent.
And why is that? Please explain. I posted your response to an email that I had sent you that I had posted on here prior to you replying. Why are you having such a hard time with that?
I have been transparent. Everything about this is on the table. Show where it isn’t. Your kid and teacher scenario, while amusing, shows exactly who the child really is.
My blogging is accurate and you do not like the fact that it is public. Sucks to be you little boy!
The Mad Ape
The Mad Ape
January 21st, 2008 at 2:41 pm
7Dan
It is there for all to read:
‘As expected, we received a storm of complaints, and of course, many mentioned the StomperNet video. After I watched the clip, one fact stood out to me: whether through ignorance, carelessness, or malice, the guy instructed everyone watching to actively violate Scribd’s Terms of Service without any kind of disclaimer to that fact. This was reflected in the common threads were consistent throughout the many complaints and apologies we received: “I didn’t know I was doing anything wrong” and “I never read the Terms of Service.’
I did watch the video. Watched 3 times so far. I was all set to subscribe to scribd then this unfolded.
I will wait for the new scribd model to be rolled out. I can hardly wait!
It is funny to see that I am the one being attacked here. Seems that the ole ‘if you don’t like the message then attack the messenger’ is alive and well.
If people do not like my tactics. Sucks to be them. I say grow up!
The Mad Ape
I Got to the Top of Google in less than 17 Hours | Tatumba.com
January 21st, 2008 at 3:32 pm
8[...] Scribd Releases Statement on StomperNet - A Mad Ape Exclusive [...]
Jon
January 21st, 2008 at 9:24 pm
9Wow, Dan Thies took time to leave a comment here. Looks like StomperNet is on some serious damage control! Thats pretty damn funny.
Dan Thies
January 22nd, 2008 at 11:37 pm
10I’m glad you can find humor in it, Jon.
The truth is, in social media, you can’t just allow someone who is distorting the truth to dominate the conversation. You know what distortion is, right? Like when you take the words “many complaints” (how many from people like the Ape?) and translate that to “the bulk of complaints.”
Jason from Scribd didn’t stand for it either, because he obviously has some scruples. It sounds like those complaints were from banned spammers trying to come up with an excuse for spamming, but Jason can characterize it more accurately than I, since I didn’t read their emails.
The facts are:
1) The “run” on Scribd started near the end of 2007, while Don Crowther’s video was released in January. I know that Scribd was identified as a sitting duck for link spam in at least one well-read blog post, by more than one person at Pubcon (early December), and that at least one coaching program (not ours) was teaching people to spam Scribd. It was inevitable that Scribd would need to address the spam problem, regardless of what Don said in January - once spammers smell blood, they pounce.
2) Don Crowther didn’t tell anyone to spam, in fact, at several points in the video he tells people not to do that. Don believes very strongly in social marketing strategies that add value. It’s unfortunate that some people decided to run off and spam, but Don didn’t tell anyone to do that, and he won’t be teaching spam in his course.
3) I do have some questions for Jason about what Don advocated that would violate their TOS, but we are reaching out to Scribd and Jason directly on that. The Scribd TOS has changed, but we have a copy of their TOS from January 5th, and the recent additions weren’t present in that version.
Dan
The Mad Ape
January 23rd, 2008 at 2:26 am
11Dan;
or should I say…My Dear Watson,
Scribd is a dead duck. Hubpages.com offers outgoing links plus a great monetization method for subscribers. The game’s afoot and scribd has cut themselves off at the knees for not handling this properly!
The Mad Ape
increase myspace plays
January 27th, 2008 at 6:37 pm
12tatumba, I heard about scribd through stompernet, coincidentally… ha
The Mad Ape
January 27th, 2008 at 7:08 pm
13As did I…as did I.
The Mad Ape
Scribd - Not the power linking channel I was hoping for…
February 8th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
14[...] any sort of deep-linking within their documents and affirmed this in a letter I came across in this blog post. Good Lesson - always important to read the fine print to ensure you are adhering to the [...]
Jason Bentley
February 10th, 2008 at 2:06 pm
15From the HubPages FAQ:
“My hub was flagged as overly promotional, what does that mean?
Purely promotional offers and Hubs designed only to promote other sites or businesses are not allowed. In particular, the following actions are likely to get your hubs flagged:
* linking repeatedly to the same site within a hub or across many hubs
* including links to a page that contains largely the same content as your hub
* linking to products or services unrelated to a Hub’s content”
I swear this ape guy is out to get everyone banned form their favorite sites.
Mad Ape
February 10th, 2008 at 5:56 pm
16Yeah that’s it…a big conspiracy is afoot. Admit it…hubpages.com has you worried.
Be careful Jason, the outbound links gremlin is giving scribd a beeeotch slappin’
The Mad Ape
Jason Bentley
February 12th, 2008 at 11:52 am
17LOL. So, HubPages and Scribd are competing products, eh? I guess that’s why you’re the marketing expert.
Still, that doesn’t change the fact you’re flat-out lying to people.
The Mad Ape
February 15th, 2008 at 8:59 am
18Flat out lying? Those are might strong words. Either issue a retraction or deal with me legally. Your immature behavior has crossed the line.
The Mad Ape
Loogie
February 15th, 2008 at 4:46 pm
19Children children children. Why must you always project such negativity? Let it go Ape. You are partly to blame. Jason smarten up. You are representing a big company and looking pretty foolish.
:L
Jason Bentley
February 19th, 2008 at 12:45 pm
20Loogie: I’d be more concerned about looking foolish if the blogger wasn’t actually advising people to violate the terms of services of websites like Scribd and HubPages. It’s important to call out liars and parasites where you find them, whether they’re in the White House or in self-serving little backwater blogs like this.
The Mad Ape
April 17th, 2008 at 9:05 am
21I would not have given this a second look, but this Scribd weasel accuses me of having people violate the TOS of Scribd and Hubpages.
Funny, I don’t recall ever making such statements. Please inform me oh learned one.
By the way Jason, you sure spend a lot of time on this little backwater self-serving blog. My my I am flattered.
Things must be slow up in the Penthouse today huh?
…watches watch to see how long it takes for Jason to descend into the swamp
Tim
May 1st, 2008 at 10:45 pm
22Hi Jason,
I am not choosing sides with this one. I definitely appreciate the TOS aspect
of what you are doing, and thank you……But,
Are you sure you want to battle the likes of Don Crowther and StomperNet?
Could have nasty consequences for Scribd.
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